Home » Public » Trans Political Issues » Pre and Non Ops not allowed to fly in Canada (ID Screening Regulations: Aeronautics Act)
| Pre and Non Ops not allowed to fly in Canada [message #156687] |
Mon, 30 January 2012 05:19  |
Isolde 
Messages: 1406
Registered: April 2010
Location: Canada |
Senior Member
Sacrificial Virgin To The Canadian Pharma Hellmouth
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http://laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2007-82/FullTe xt.html
This the Identity Screening Regulations from the current Aeronautics Act in Canada.
I'd like to bring your attention to Sec 5.2(1)(c)
where it states:
5.2 (1) An air carrier shall not transport a passenger if
...
(c)
the passenger does not appear to be of the gender indicated on the identification he or she presents;
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| Re: Pre and Non Ops not allowed to fly in Canada [message #156741 is a reply to message #156737 ] |
Mon, 30 January 2012 20:03  |
Isolde
Messages: 1406
Registered: April 2010
Location: Canada |
Senior Member
Sacrificial Virgin To The Canadian Pharma Hellmouth
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| Derrie wrote on Mon, 30 January 2012 22:28 |
From an Anon User~
From the law. ... a letter from a doctor and your good to go. Inconvenient yes but not a show stopper.
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That's all well and good if you're under the care of a doctor. Which is not the case for MANY trans people. Nor do you need to have any hrt or medical procedures to be considered trans. In fact there's NO requirement for you change your name, you could be completely non-op AND non-hrt, and still present as your target gender.
One of the requirements for HRT in Canada via the CAMH (the people you have to go through if you want SRS [though you don't *have* to go through them for hrt]) is that you live as your target gender for a certain amount of time PRIOR to being given any medication. So why would a doctor give you a letter if you are not on any medication or under their care at all?
Nor is this the case for anybody who chooses to present as a gender different from their legally assigned sex.
Really though, this Act has been in place since the end of July and there haven't been any incidents yet. Nobody actually checks, and if they do, the people are either sympathetic or negligent in their duties.
HOWEVER, the issues are
a) It can happen, and if it does, it's completely legal.
b) The Harper government let this pass, and this unacceptable, under the Harper government we have seen more and more anti-trans and anti-lgb sentiments emerge than ever before. This needs to be drawn attention to, and it needs to be remedied.
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| Re: Pre and Non Ops not allowed to fly in Canada [message #156800 is a reply to message #156799 ] |
Tue, 31 January 2012 17:54 |
Isolde
Messages: 1406
Registered: April 2010
Location: Canada |
Senior Member
Sacrificial Virgin To The Canadian Pharma Hellmouth
Standard Petulant and Pedantic Personage |
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| Katica wrote on Tue, 31 January 2012 20:36 |
As long as you are seeing a therapist and have a "carry letter" from them, Izzie, it's a non issue.
I went through the border by car and plane numerous times and a couple of times had to produce my carry letter. Once they had that, they were fine.
And my therapist issued that to me at my second appointment. Before HRT and before anything else.
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Regarding the use of a carry letter.
I think it needs to be pointed out that not every one has a carry letter for numerous valid reasons. For example,
- they are not trans, but rather gender variant in any other number of ways.
- they are on 'do it yourself' hormones (they are getting their hormones without a doctors consent)
- they are non-operative and non-hrt, but choosing to live full time. Being trans doesn't mean you have to take hormones. (being trans doesn't even mean you have to pass)
- People transitioning under through the CAMH are required to live full time prior to being giving hormones, and would therefore not have a carry letter either.
There are MANY scenarios, very real and plausible scenarios, where a person would not be in a position to have a 'carry letter'.
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| Re: Pre and Non Ops not allowed to fly in Canada [message #156804 is a reply to message #156687 ] |
Tue, 31 January 2012 20:31 |
Katica
Messages: 748
Registered: October 2007
Location: Edmonton |
Senior Member
BL3D
Wicked Bitch Of The North |
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Izzie;
First, a carry letter is not dependent upon hormones. Never has been, really. The carry letter, generally, simply states that the person carrying the letter is in the process of gender transition and should be accorded the same treatment as any other person of that gender.
So there is no reference to surgery or hormones in a carry letter. As such, whether you are on hormones is irreleveant.
I had mine before I ever started hormones. When I really, really did not pass.
Second, if you are living full time and are non-HRT for whatever reason, you may still have a carry letter. Again - not dependent on hormones.
Third, if CAMH does not give people a carry letter, then that is yet another failure on the part of the Jurassic Clarke/CAMH. It is definitely not the norm. If they are insisting that their patients be on hormones before they will issue such a letter, then that is an issue that needs to be dealt with by CAMH and their patients. Again, far from the norm.
And while I do not personally believe in the absolute binary of gender, unfortunately we a trans people still have to live in the real world. The rest of the world is generally looking for one gender or the other. And short of omitting gender or allowing an "X" like Australia plans on doing, then one must make decision as to how one will present to the world.
As much as I despise the current government in place, this is less about their agenda as it is about the politics of gender on a far broader scale. And I'm afraid until their is some international agreement on the genderqueer we are stuck with the binary. And by international agreement - at least in terms of travel, that means getting new rules and the like via ICAO (International Civil Aviation Organization) who develop the guidelines that most countries abide by when it comes to travel and travel identity documents.
Until that happens, travel will always be an issue for the gender variant.
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| Re: Pre and Non Ops not allowed to fly in Canada [message #156805 is a reply to message #156804 ] |
Tue, 31 January 2012 21:00 |
Isolde
Messages: 1406
Registered: April 2010
Location: Canada |
Senior Member
Sacrificial Virgin To The Canadian Pharma Hellmouth
Standard Petulant and Pedantic Personage |
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| Katica wrote on Tue, 31 January 2012 23:31 | Izzie;
First, a carry letter is not dependent upon hormones. Never has been, really. The carry letter, generally, simply states that the person carrying the letter is in the process of gender transition and should be accorded the same treatment as any other person of that gender.
So there is no reference to surgery or hormones in a carry letter. As such, whether you are on hormones is irreleveant.
I had mine before I ever started hormones. When I really, really did not pass.
Second, if you are living full time and are non-HRT for whatever reason, you may still have a carry letter. Again - not dependent on hormones.
Third, if CAMH does not give people a carry letter, then that is yet another failure on the part of the Jurassic Clarke/CAMH. It is definitely not the norm. If they are insisting that their patients be on hormones before they will issue such a letter, then that is an issue that needs to be dealt with by CAMH and their patients. Again, far from the norm.
And while I do not personally believe in the absolute binary of gender, unfortunately we a trans people still have to live in the real world. The rest of the world is generally looking for one gender or the other. And short of omitting gender or allowing an "X" like Australia plans on doing, then one must make decision as to how one will present to the world.
As much as I despise the current government in place, this is less about their agenda as it is about the politics of gender on a far broader scale. And I'm afraid until their is some international agreement on the genderqueer we are stuck with the binary. And by international agreement - at least in terms of travel, that means getting new rules and the like via ICAO (International Civil Aviation Organization) who develop the guidelines that most countries abide by when it comes to travel and travel identity documents.
Until that happens, travel will always be an issue for the gender variant.
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Yes, you're right about carry letters not being dependent upon hrt. However that wasn't my point. I was bringing up hrt as a possible (one of many) way to obtain a carry letter, but that avenue might not be an option for many people.
However, a carry letter must be written by a doctor. Who are doctors? the people give you therapy, the people who prescribe hormones, the people who perform surgery. Hence the issue of being on hormones, etc., is important and pertinent to this topic.
Bottom line. There ARE people who this affects. There ARE people that don't have a carry letter. There are people that have no way of obtaining a carry letter.
By making a rule about requiring a carry letter, it is essentially saying that to be able to fly, you MUST comply to a specific set of guidelines. This is wrong because there are NO legal requirements to transition - NONE! Yes we have the Standards of Care, but those are just suggestions. There is no legislation saying that you HAVE to follow them.
And regardless if people want to believe or not, or whether they agree with it, people DO transition outside of the standards of care. People do buy hrt without a prescription. Some people don't see therapists.
Obviously this wasn't a direct attack against trans people. But you have to admit that in the past few years there has been an increasing amount of anti-trans-rights sentiment being pushed by our government. Be it in the form of Identity screening regulations like the above, or the adamant opposition to bills like Bill C389, Bill C279, etc. by the conservative party. So, again, while this probably wasn't a direct attack against trans rights, I doubt that there was any serious (or even cursory) consideration about trans rights when the Minister of Transportation made these changes.
I'm sorry, but just as negligence of the law is not an excuse to commit crime, negligence of human rights is not a free pass to discriminate.
And as a final statement, it will only take one transphobic airport employee to *abuse* these regulations and still be technically following the law.
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| Re: Pre and Non Ops not allowed to fly in Canada [message #156888 is a reply to message #156687 ] |
Thu, 02 February 2012 11:38 |
Isolde
Messages: 1406
Registered: April 2010
Location: Canada |
Senior Member
Sacrificial Virgin To The Canadian Pharma Hellmouth
Standard Petulant and Pedantic Personage |
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http://www.xtra.ca/public/National/UPDATE_Conservative_MPs_l augh_at_concerns_that_trans_people_face_flight_ban-11450.asp x
So apparently Conservative party Members of Parliament think trans issues are funny.
| Quote: | Chow says Lebel and other Conservative MPs were openly "snickering" and disrespectfully mocking Garrison, Morin and Liberal MP Justin Trudeau as they pressed the government for answers.
"The response was outrageous," Chow says. "It's totally ridiculous. If you listen to the audio, you can hear [Conservative MPs] snickering in the background."
Garrison says Conservative MPs were "making light" of a very serious situation.
"To them, I guess there's something funny about transgendered people. It was quite offensive," he says. "This is a basic violation of rights and fuels discrimination of transgender people, not only with the regulation, but actually laughing at the question."
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[Updated on: Thu, 02 February 2012 16:15] by Moderator
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